05/02/2004 - 2:29 AM

Matt: i'm sure groups like jars of clay had lots of secular influences... musically especially and toad the wet sprocket is for sure got to be one of them...

John: well, Toad always had a spiritual side...their biggest hits were about faith and learning and struggling

Matt: true, but a bit more "unknown" than say jars of clay

Matt: ha ha

Matt: i mean ultimately, still not a christian group, although definately spiritual

Matt: although i think a lot of music that comes from this society, which is a post-christian, or christian influenced society, has those christian overtones... whether positive or negative...

John: true

John: I don't think I can call myself a Christian...but I am definitely spiritual

Matt: well i think being a christian means simply admiring the life of christ and wanting to eminate it in your own life...

Matt: at it's very base meaning, that's what it is

John: I believe in Christ and his teaching, and think it was a noble life, but I feel that way about Gandhi, too

Matt: it doesn't matter what the church has done with his story in the 2000 years since then... that's all inconsequential

John: I'm Gandhian, too

John: LOL

Matt: i think there's something more unique about the life of christ...

Matt: even moreso than ghandi or buddha, i mean sure they were great men too, with something to say... but it's okay to be un-pc and rank them personally i think... lol

Matt: but whatever i find deeply resonant in my own life doesn't have to be what everyone else does... and that's fine... but i often long for the people i am close to to feel similar to me because we can grow together in deeper ways i think... you want to grow together when you share deep beliefs...

John: I completely agree, and I do feel a resonance with the life of Christ. I just can't bring myself to use "Christian" to describe me, though.

Matt: i think that christian ideas (meaning the life of christ, not the "church") are totally radical and unique... i think they are at times, *very* different than in other major world religions... and i think it's a truly beautiful and revolutionary way of thinking... in fact i wish i had been better about it in the past and even in the present, i would like to try harder to follow those teachings...

John: it's about adapting it to your life, though. not following a blueprint. I think you do a pretty admirable job of living that life

Matt: it's about both really

Matt: some things are indeed true, and black and white, some things are not...

Matt: i don't think it's about getting caught up in dogma, or social issues, but i do think it's about learning to be selfless, learning to love unconditionally, learning the principles of forgiveness... really learning them and putting them into practice, stuff like that...

John: you and me both

Matt: i dunno... i really really believe that... very deeply... it's hugely important to me... and like i said, i don't think the rest of the world has to think like i do, i trust God to show and give people what they need to know when they need to know it (including me)... but i do value very much being able to connect with people on those levels at times...

John: well, I hope you don't feel like we're in two different places on this

Matt: even Trisha and i, as much as i love her and agree with her in so many ways, do disagree on more than a few things... but that's okay, i do get a lot out of being there...

Matt: well i do and i don't... i mean i'm so glad that spirituality has become an important thing to you, i think it always has been but it means a lot to me that you like to go to church and like to explore more...

John: I have a feeling I may be closer to Trisha theologically than you are

Matt: do i wish you could feel like you could call yourself a Christian? yes, very much... and i can't say it wouldn't seem strange to me or hard for me in the future, but for now i can have peace about that i think, given where we both are and where our relationship is... i have to find balance somehow...

John: it's always been important to me...it's been a long journey coming to this point. the only reason I continue to go to church is because I have a common thread with the teachings there. I'm not there because it's a church or because I feel I have to be part of a community

John: I hope you can find that balance...the distance isn't as far as you might think it is sometimes

Matt: on a human-to-human level, i'm so okay with you being who you are where you are when you are... i have to respect that... and i do... but to be intimate with you and build a future with you, i'd be lying if i said it wasn't a bit of a concern for me, but nothing to get excited about at this point... i mean we'll just see...

John: be honest...if I was Jewish, would you lean away from a commitment to me because I don't believe that Jesus is the son of God?

Matt: for a very very long time, since i was a very little boy, even when i began to make peace with being gay at 12 and 13 years old... i wanted so very very much to be someday with someone who was also a christian, who i had that connection with on both those levels, and i think that's very deep in me still... that's just where i'm coming from for better for for worse...

Matt: honestly? yeah probably...

Matt: i mean jason and i never had that discussion, but to me that was one reason, of many, that we were always better as best friends, and it all worked out for the best the way it did...

John: but you thought you found that in Nate, and look where that got you? it's never going to be a full-on match, but it's about finding a comfort level and common ground, and there's a lot of common ground

Matt: i'm sure he'd be a little hurt maybe to hear that, but i can't help that, a person's faith is their faith, it's not something that any of us should have to feel ashamed of or sorry about... we're not talking about not giving someone a job, we're talking about your life partner... lol

Matt: well Nate was just not in the right place, he had and probably has, his own issues and problems to deal with, he was not as mature as he pretended to be... the whole thing was built on a mirage of sorts... and faith was just one part of it, a big one but just a part...

Matt: it was wrong for me to think that that faith would "hold it all together" and make other issues *go away* that was the big error and fallacy...

John: I guess all I'm saying is that faith is a big part of our lives, but it's still a part. I truly believe we're much closer than the differences we may have over that one word

Matt: but it's important to me that's all i'm saying... i'm not asking you to react to that one way or the other, i'm just stating how i feel

John: the fact that we're having this conversation means so much, and just further strengthens my faith in this relationship

Matt: to me it's not a word, it's a state of mind, a state of being... and it's big to me, that's all...

Matt: i would like to have this conversation times 5000 in the future... lol... i mean i'm open to anything... that's the way people grow and learn... on both sides...

John: I think we share the state of mind and the state of being, except through the embodiment of one person

Matt: it's not about me drawing a line in the sand and saying "you must be over here" but i think i can say "i would really like to be with someone who is over here and maybe we can look at why i feel that way and why you don't or whatever else... explore the details..."

John: I don't discount anything in Christ's teachings...his vision, his compassion, his actions speak volumes.

John: I'd really like to talk about this more in person, actually. I really want to learn more about where you're coming from

Matt: well there's all the time in the world for that really... i mean i'm not going anywhere... lol

Matt: but yes, we'll have those discussions, we have to, cause on some level they are important to me before moving on to other levels in intimacy...

John: and I'm not either. and there's no way I'm going to let one definition get in the way of that

Matt: but it's not a definition to me...

Matt: lol

Matt: or a word

Matt: that's very important to me, that it's not those things to me...

John: I won't lie, though. I feel like you've got these set conditions and timeframes and limits to how and where this relationship goes. that concerns me

Matt: maybe some, but they are not closed to discussion, you know that... and i won't apologize for all of those...

Matt: if a person knows what they would like in life it's not wrong or bad

John: yeah...but it's not something that can be written down in advance and followed to the letter, either

John: life happens

Matt: but some can

John: a few

John: the big ones

Matt: well i think the big ones are the ones i focus on

Matt: i don't think i'm that immutable on small stuff

Matt: i might seem that way at times, but when have we not been able to talk it through?

John: no...I always feel like I can talk to you about these things. I don't always see the potential for a compromise, though

Matt: but the bigger stuff? it's okay to want to have a plan or to let people know what's important to you... you do that with anything else... school, your career, whatever... long term planning and goals, and sure they get changed sometimes, maybe slightly mabye majorly... maybe not at all...

Matt: of course i'm also mindful that a relationship is two people and not one, and that both opinions have to be valued and thought over, but i don't think it's wrong on the big stuff to yearn for and want compatibility so that you have a foundation to build on for years to come...

John: all I'm saying is that there have been times that I've expressed ideas/beliefs/concerns to you that I believe strongly in, and I haven't always felt that you responded to them

Matt: well sometimes you might have to ask me to respond...

Matt: i doubt it's been intentional

John: fair enough. I guess I feel like if I've talked to you about something, and nothing changes, I don't want to browbeat you into responding. it's my fault for not revisiting

Matt: what specifically?

John: probably the biggest has been our differences in our sex life

Matt: i dunno what to do about that... i mean, it's hard to make yourself be or feel differently at times when you don't...

John: I can't argue with that...and I don't expect you to become my ideal sexual fantasy. that's not fair to anyone

John: I guess an acknowledgement of the concerns I express past the inital discussion would help

Matt: well you know... i have gained a lot of weight in the past year and i have been under stress a lot at times off and on, and those things really inhibit my sex drive, and even if those things were gone and my sex drive went up (which it would to some extent) i don't think i'd be as much into sex as a lot of guys i know, but i don't think i would if i were straight either, it's part personality...

Matt: upbringing, etc...

John: I'm sorry for bringing this up online...I know we should be discussing this in person

Matt: well online is better than not at all

Matt: lol

John: agreed

Matt: sex is a part of any relationship, and should be... if there were *no* sex or *no* attraction at all, that would be bad... but to me it's maybe 4th or 5th down on the list... a relationship is so much more than the sex to me... it's just how i see it, it doesn't mean again that everyone has to feel the way i do...

John: we talked last August about what I enjoy with a partner that I'm committed to (including intercourse), and I dont' feel like that's been addressed since then

John: there are times I truly wonder if you're attracted to me

John: and that's my own insecurity talking, but the voice is still there

John: physically, anyway

Matt: why would i be with you if i weren't attracted to you? why would i tell you you are cute if i didn't think so?

Matt: i wouldn't lie

Matt: i can't help it that my sex drive is lower

Matt: it just is...

Matt: i have no idea what to do about that

John: I don't think there's a doubt about that mentally, spiritually, emotionally

John: this is just a situation I've never been in before

Matt: it's not like just sitting through a movie you don't want to see for two hours... having anal sex is kind of an involved thing...

Matt: and i'm just not a huge anal sex person

Matt: i never really have been

John: and when we first started dating, you mentioned how you thought you had a higher than average sex drive

Matt: and i'm not sure i see myself being one... i dunno... i'm just being totally honest here...

John: now you're saying that you know it's lower

Matt: look, i just told you... i have gained what? 40 pounds in the last year or two...

John: and that gets me confused

Matt: maybe 50

Matt: i just don't feel good about myself

Matt: it affects things

John: I understand that...but you just mentioned your upbringing and your personality, too

Matt: and i do have a high sex drive when i tend to be in better shape and healthier... but that tends to revolve a lot more around oral sex and other kinds of sex, fingering and whatnot, than it does anal sex, it's always been that way

Matt: you know it's funny cause i get the sense that the sexual question is a bigger deal for you than it is for me, cause i'm totally content right now, but i get the feeling that the spiritual/religious question is a bigger deal for me than for you cause you're totally content with that the way it is...

John: I'm not content with it...I'm trying to find my way here, and until I met you, I think I was fine finding that way without the assistance of a church. I'm open to that now, and I have you to thank

John: I wouldn't be going to church almost weekly and making appointments to see Trisha if I was content with where it's at

Matt: i spose, maybe not a fair one to one correlation

Matt: my bad

John: and I hope you don't think I'm there just to get in good graces and get closer to you, too

Matt: nope

Matt: i don't think that

John: good

Matt: cause really like i said, Trisha and i agreeing and disagreeing is about 50/50

John: I'm glad that's not the case

Matt: there are certain things that i would disagree with almost the entire church on at times...

Matt: lol

Matt: but it wouldn't be any different at a conservative church

Matt: so just make due

Matt: God gives me what i need where i get it, in many places...

John: you've awakened a different side of me that hasn't been an issue in other relationships, and I'm completely open to exploring that. I'm not set in stone

John: but it's already there...it's just being open to it and actually seeing it

John: it's been there all along

Matt: well i dunno... i've not been in a lot of relationships that were over a year... i don't think Malcolm and i had sex that often either... if i remember right...

Matt: part of it might be my own issues... i don't tend to associate emotional intimacy and sex past certain points at times, i have to really work towards that...

Matt: but i don't totally disconnect the two like some poeple do... which is good...

Matt: so my relationships are not *totally* dysfunctinonal or anything

John: LOL...this is good to know

John: only partially? ; )

Matt: but i do tend sometimes to see pure sexual attraction as something almost between strangers...

Matt: i do tend to still give sex the attributes of lust and just pure raw almost "naughtiness" you know?

Matt: that's partially my religious background for sure

John: I want to bring the emotional into the sexual...they shouldn't be exclusive

Matt: but luckily for me...

Matt: my parents did have a healthy sex life

Matt: and were pretty open about it on a certain level

John: that is good

Matt: so that helps counteract the religious ideas some

John: I'm glad it lasted more than just a year

John: : D

Matt: lol well yes, me too

Matt: i dunno... i think in some ways i might need to you be a bit more agressive at times about it...

Matt: i think there's more room for me to "give" a bit more at times

Matt: but i need the encouragement

John: well, I also need you to be more aggressive about it

Matt: i'm not going to just hear you say that you like anal sex and then say to myself "gosh i should try to initiate something i'm not in the mood for more"

John: there are times where I feel like you just do it because you feel you have to

Matt: lol

Matt: well it *always* feels good in the end

John: it's not only for the anal

Matt: sometimes i am tired though, and not motivated... but again

Matt: i'm out of shape, i'm tired, i'm stressed a lot

Matt: at least lately

John: I want to help

Matt: i'm not really a morning person but then again, sex wise i'm not really a late late night person either

Matt: i mean i'm usually at my best late afternoon early evening

Matt: in all aspects

Matt: not just sexually... but mentally

Matt: etc.

John: *nod*

Matt: i have probably taken advantage of this relationship in some ways

Matt: because it's comfortable

Matt: and easy to me

Matt: and tha'ts *very good*

Matt: cause that can be a rare thing

Matt: but it's been such an up and down life in a lot of ways in the last year or so

Matt: especially the last six months

Matt: that it's been easy for me to lean on the relationship

John: well, that's one of many things I'm here for

Matt: i truly enjoy just knowing it's there and not always having to worry about it... and i guess that's bad of me at times...

Matt: i shouldn't take you for granted

John: I know we don't live together or have a commitment through a church, but I feel like we are partners in a lot of ways

Matt: i don't mean for it to come across as lack of attraction or not caring...

Matt: i do feel that way yes

John: I never feel you don't care

Matt: but if you know my personality type and my way of thinking and being you know... it's like one of the biggest compliments i can pay a person is to just treat them like they are a fixture in my life...

John: maybe "fixture" is a bad choice of words ... LOL

Matt: sometimes if i don't call you a lot or if i seem like i don't have a ton to say , it's almost a compliment in my personality type world... because it means i dont' have to go through any motions to prove to you i'm there or you're there for me...

Matt: the time i have apart from you is equally important to me as the time we have together... one makes the other more meaningful...

John: but there are also times you just shut down, and I hear about what's troubling you days later. it may be a compliment, but that clashes with the way I'm programmed

Matt: but i have to process things sometimes

Matt: it doesn't mean i'm leaving you out of the loop cause no other human being is hearing it either

Matt: i don't always get something thown at me and automatically go public with it... i think i'll get better at that over time with you cause you're not just anyone...

Matt: but sometimes too i'm going to have to have some processing time

John: I can understand that

Matt: i'm proud of having a relationship that has two independent minded stable adults in it...

John: as am I

Matt: i'm very proud that we don't have to go over the top at times with sappiness or neediness like a lot fo couples

Matt: i feel like the balance is good... i feel like our private moments are also our most intimate and that is how it should be...

John: but a little of that is okay, too, isn't it? ; )

Matt: i feel like we do have some sappiness, but neediness... i dunno... i want my partner to be a compliment, and i do need them but needy and needed are slightly different...

Matt: needy implies low self esteem or low level of belief in the relationship's stability or trust...

John: i suppose you're right, there

Matt: i dunno what better way to show you or prove to you that i'm hear for you than that i've been here the whole way... as have you for me...

Matt: i haven't gone anywhere, we haven't had any off again on again breakups or changes

Matt: we have done a great job of making it a smooth ride for both of us and that builds trust i hope...

Matt: i mean if i really wasn't attracted to you, on any level, and if i really thought this relationship had no future, i'd have been gone a long time ago, i mean you know me... you know i wouldn't lie to you or myself or hang around for the sake of boredom...

John: true...but I have also seen you lean on the relationship, too. it creates a little bit of doubt, even if it is unintentional, and that's why I'm glad we're talking about this right now

Matt: yeah but i have leaned on being single at times too when i was single

Matt: i'm very very good at both i think...

Matt: and that's just me being honest

Matt: lol

Matt: i mean i was always a very happy well-adjusted single person

Matt: i never "needed" anyone

Matt: there are a lot of ways being single would be a lot easier, and there are a lot of ways being coupled is a lot easier... it's 50/50 to me

John: despite the independence, though...do you feel you need me?

Matt: i really do love you for who you are, every last goofy bit of you (at times lol) and i accept that... i accept you the way you are...

Matt: and i guess i just want to feel like you also love me for who i am, and that "who i am" is a lot of times not as expressive or as outwardly emotional as you...

John: but I'm accepting you and loving you for who you are. this goes back to your concerns about the person you want to be with, and what that person believes

Matt: i do need you, in your very own unique way i need you, but i also need my parents, in their own unique way too... the close relationships i have in my life, yes i need them... they are very important to me, but when God wants me to have them i'll have them and i was not spossed to have them i wouldn't...

John: you fit everything I could ever ask for as a partner, recognizing there will never be a perfect match

Matt: but you seem to have beliefs too about what a person should express, at least mininally, emotionally and sexually... and i feel like i must not measure up to those things at times... at least in your own way of wanting it...

John: it's crazy of me to think I could find perfection, but you're as close as I could ever hope to get

Matt: and in regards to the sex, all i can say is that a lot of times will be like this, but there will also be better times, i can gaurentee it... but in regards to the emotional component, being emotionally verbal or outwardly emotional, i've always been this way, i can try harder sure, but on some level i like being me too... i'm who i am...

John: when we get right down to it, as long as I know the beliefs are there, then how they're expressed is secondary

Matt: i agree with that... and i'd hope that you realize that when i say "i love you" i mean it... it's inconsequential how often or when as much as it is that it's said and believed and meant...

Matt: the same with other things like "you're cute" or "you look great" or "i'm so glad i'm with you"

Matt: i dunno...

Matt: it's all part of just being two different people

John: I feel like you might think i say "I love you" too much. you don't say it much to me first

Matt: but you've set the precedent for saying it often and first, so i don't even have to think about it all the time anymore

Matt: i would always say i loved you before i went to bed...

Matt: that's just how i was raied

Matt: raised

Matt: and i would always say i loved you on the phone if we were out of town, one or the other of us...

Matt: but i'm not sure i am used to always saying i love you on the phone especially if i'm seeing you once or more than once that day... but i can work with that

John: this is true

Matt: i'm just not used to it

Matt: but i would hope you know i love you, always...

John: I do

Matt: it is nice to say it... to me it's somewhere in between, it can be said not enough, but it can also be said to much... to me personally anyway...

John: I just don't want to make you feel uncomfortable, either

Matt: the happiness is in the sort of medium... being told gives me a warm feeling, but sometimes not having to be told gives me the same warm feeling

John: I can understand that

John: I guess I'd just like you to be moved by a moment where you just felt the need to say it outside of those two conditioned responses

Matt: if i'm moved though it should be and will be because i'm moved, not because i need to be moved more : )

John: heh heh...and you don't feel any type of discomfort saying it outside of the usual perameters?

Matt: and i admit i'm not prone to being "moved" as much as other poeple, i don't find it that incredible to find someone i love a lot and am compatible with, it's not surreal or amazing to me to be honest, it's a gift from God and from life and i'm okay with it, i appreciate it and love it, but i can accept it... i dunno i'm just different...

Matt: i find loving and being loved to be totally comfortable and believeable and i find myself "worthy" of it... so i guess i tend to get emotional less in that respect... but it doesn't mean i don't appreciate it or that i'm not thankful... not by a long shot...

John: that's a good mindset to have on it

Matt: and i dunno that it's so much that i'm ever "uncomfortable" with any "i love you" situations... uncomfortable is not the right idea or word...

Matt: it's more that just sometimes i'm just not thinking about that at all

Matt: and then when it's said i'm like "oh... okay"

Matt: i mean a lot of times on short phone conversations in the middle of the day...

Matt: i'm just not used to that or thinking in that direction

Matt: it's just habit and upbringing again, and second nature

Matt: so it's not about who is right or wrong

John: ok

Matt: and this is just my subconscious thinking, and again it's not about whose thinking is right and whose is wrong...

Matt: but in my mind sometimes, when a lot of "i love you" is happening in situations like that... i think subconsciously it makes me feel *less* stable about things...

Matt: cause i think "wow, why is this having to be said so much, is he wanting to make sure i respond and how i respond? was it not believable last night when i said it?"

John: and of course that's the furthest thing from my mind

Matt: again it's just what i'm used to, it's not "i'm right, you're wrong"...

Matt: i'm just used to touching base through the day... and then at the end of a day whether that's in bed together or on the phone before bed... being able to say "goodnight, i love you"

John: I like the fact that in the middle of just living my life, something happens that reminds me of just why I love you

Matt: and yes, there *are* those occasions that are outside of those situations... sometimes, at a park, on a hike, on an anniversary, just for whatever reason, it can be spontaneous...

Matt: i'm not saying that it doesn't happen spontaneously... maybe even throughout the week... but i'm not used to it every conversation, i guess that's what i'm saying

Matt: and that's just me

Matt: somehow, in my thinking, it almost cheapens it...

John: fair enough

Matt: or makes it mechanical

Matt: cheapens is a bad word

Matt: i mean i don't think ideally having sex once every two week is the best either...

Matt: but you have to admit

Matt: we have vastly different job schedules

Matt: we still live apart

Matt: on top of the other factors i mentioned

Matt: physical fitness, stress, etc.

John: but the other factors can be improved, too

Matt: and i'm sure will be

Matt: which is maybe why i haven't seemed as concerned

Matt: i didn't mean for my lack of concern to mean that i think it's always the best situation right now

Matt: it's more just that i figure some factors are not permanent

John: but if we don't talk about them, then I don't know that

Matt: but maybe not immediately fixable

Matt: sure, which is why i'm glad you asked

Matt: cause yes, it has occured to me that you might wonder about it all

Matt: but it hadn't occured to me enough to mention it myself

John: but you've intimated that you knew there was a disconnect there, and you haven't felt the need to bring it up

Matt: cause i think i was the one who was more okay with it for the time being... but you didn't know that or have a way to know that...

John: I'm not saying you're negligent, because everyone handles those issues differently. but if you see factors on your end that are affecting both of us in one form or another, I'd hope you'd bring it up without being prompted

Matt: well i'm not sure i would or could know what is "not enough" for you and at what point you just absolutely can't stand for it the way it is...

Matt: but it wasn't affecting me that much... i was fine with it... and it's hard for me to read what it is for you

John: it's not even an issue of enough or not enough

Matt: i wasn't thinking you were "thrilled" but then again i wasn't thinking you were exactly totally miserable either

Matt: so i figured you were also like me just being patient with the myriad factors going into it

John: and I have been patient

Matt: i mean to be graphic for example... the tip of my penis was ticklish for some reason and has been for the past week or two... not sure if it's just some passing thing or what... but that affects things, my allergies have been bad, that affects things, a lot of times i'm irregular which makes me self consious about anything anal, and i have the issues about topping anyway... i mean there are things

Matt: that go into it that have nothing to do with if you are attracted to the other person...

John: this is good to know

Matt: i'm also very weird about oral hygeine, i *love* to kiss but i have a very hard time kissing if i feel like i have really bad breath or the other person does... for some reason it's not as bad if both people have bad breath to me, lol, but ideally i love when both people have good breath... so that's weird and inhibiting to me at times too...

Matt: but those kinds of things are hard to just say to anyone...

John: and you did't have a problem with the bad breath last night...LOL

Matt: and i have dated people before like even Nate who were total prisses who *did* say things to me or people they dated and i found it so offputting to have people tell you things like that... so a lot of times i try to just go with it, even if i'm not as into it, but that's bad too i realize...

Matt: we both had garlic breath, i don't consider garlic breath bad breath

Matt: i love garlic!

Matt: lol

Matt: i mean i got criticized once by Nate for kissing him with my eyes open, and had it insinuated that i wasn't a good kisser to him...

John: that bastard

Matt: so i'm very self consious about criticizing people about things, but then again, some things are mental blocks to me, or keep me from being as turned on... so it's like being in a catch 22

John: why do people have to be so damn shallow like that?

Matt: but you know what... i'm overwhelmingly attracted to you and nothing about you is such a huge hangup that i can't deal with it... and i'm sure you feel the same about me...

Matt: and the things i mentioned are not specific to you

Matt: they would be true for anyone

Matt: and have been

John: that does help

Matt: i'm just explaining a lot of factors that go into why i might react or be certain ways at certain times...

Matt: it can be anything from i'm really tired to my allergies are killing me to i have awful breath and am self conscious kissing...

Matt: but you just worry about making excuses cause you dont' want to sound like a broken record

Matt: "not tonight honey... XYZ"

John: you lost me on that last part

Matt: i'm saying that sometimes if i'm not always giving a reason for why i'm acting the way i am...

Matt: or not feeling frisky or whatever, or seeming totally into it...

Matt: i'm sometimes bad about saying why, because i had being seen as that quintisential person/partner

Matt: who is always makign excuses

Matt: like "not tonight i have a headache"

Matt: lol

John: ah, okay

Matt: i mean i'ts hard to just say "you know what, tomorrow can we have sex between 4 and 7 pm instead?"

Matt: or "hey can we both get up and go brush our teeth and gargle before we get into bed again?"

Matt: lol

Matt: i mean it just seems so ridiculous, i'd feel so guilty

Matt: or so bossy

John: heh heh...but knowing it's an issue does help

Matt: but then if i don't, then i roll over and go to sleep

Matt: and then you think i'm just not attracted to you

Matt: or hate sex

Matt: lol

Matt: so see what i mean?

Matt: it's like a catch 22

John: well, as long as the dialogue is open, that's never going to be an issue

Matt: i'm not used to expressing certain things

Matt: i hate to seem rude

Matt: or like a picky person

John: yeah...that's what I think of when I think of you ; )

Matt: i mean i'd love to be that sexually open minded and loose person, who is in touch with so so many things and ideas... but ultimately some sexual acts and ideas and types and whatnot turn me on and some just don't... it's weird... i mean we all have our things though i guess...

Matt: i mean some people say they love it all and they really mean it

Matt: but i could sit down and look at porn with you or anyone and say "that's hot, that's not, that's in the middle"

Matt: "i love to do that, i don't do that much, i'm not into that really"

John: well, feel free to have that conversation at any time : D

Matt: lol

Matt: i have to learn to be better

Matt: i mean i have to learn to ask what you want

John: I have to learn to ask

Matt: and tell you what i don't want

John: er, not be afraid to ask

Matt: i mean some nights, i'm not sure why... the nipples are almost too sensitive, and they are more a distraction than a compliment

John: I thought that was a prerequisite

Matt: for whatever reason last night, especially if you bit or pinched them even moderately hard, it totally made me lose my erection

Matt: and i'm not sure why

Matt: but sometimes it does

Matt: especially if it's too hard

Matt: i think over the years they have become less sensitive in some ways, because they get a lot of attention... some of the other stuff like behind the legs and the armpits, are to me now what the nipples used to be more...

John: and I don't have a problem going there, either

John: man, I had no idea this conversation would go so long

Matt: lol

Matt: yeah

Matt: i know

Matt: but it's good

Matt: infinately good really

Matt: part of me is thinking about sleeping in and just meeting up with you around lunchtime tomorrow... LOL

John: I'm thinking about the same thing, actually

Matt: would you want to jog with me tomorrow afternoon in over towards city park?

John: although at this moment, I'm wishing we were curled up together, too

John: that would be great

John: I could break in the new shoes

Matt: also tomorrow night is 10.5 and Malcolm and Brad and i talked about making pizza or something and watching so if you'd like to also, you're invited of course... we'll probably do it over at Malcolm�s...

John: that'll work. and I can stay at your place and sleep until you get up, too

Matt: right, that works for sure

Matt: and yes i do with you were here... i like sleeping next to you : )

Matt: wish that is

Matt: alright... well mabye we can meet up for lunch around noon or 1pm then... you think?

Matt: if you happen to get up feel free to go to church without me... but i'll sleep i'm sure of it...

John: that would be great...I'll just play it by ear, and give you a call around 11:30

Matt: okay... sounds good : )

Matt: i'm going to go to sleep now... and by the way...

Matt: i love you : )

John: same here

John: ditto

John: : D

Matt: XO's night : )

John: xoxo

John: cya

What I'm Listening To: Yolanda Adams - Open My Heart

First Word That Comes To Mind: conversation

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